I’ve built and flown traditional RC helicopters since 2010 and only a week ago learned about Ardupilot and ArduCopter after looking into FPV equipment (so I can fly first person) and noticed the flight controllers.
I’ve been reading the Copter section nonstop and and am trying to decide whether or not to get away from FBL units and buy my first flight controller.
I have a LOT of questions, but I’ll try to keep it to just a few simple ones for now.
Those of you who have transitioned from FBL units to flight controller, do you recommend it? Do they feel equal or better than say an iKon, Vbar, or Bavarian?
Which controller would you recommend to start with?
I’d like to start with my Align 800 DFC, but from what I’ve read so far, maybe that’s not a good idea! I work on real aircraft and am tedious. If I were to carefully follow the instructions for setup and tuning, what are the chances of a crash early on? Align parts dry up and certain components can be hard to find sometimes.
I have an older JR X9503 radio (Spektrum DSM2…SRXL2 with newer receivers) and high voltage servos. Will all or most flight controllers be compatible with this hardware?
I’m pretty new to heli in general and have been learning on both traditional FBL and autopilot FC. Ardupilot works great for many things but if its right for you might depend a lot on what sort of flying you want to do and what else you want to do with your heli. It can be much cheaper and offer a lot more options and capabilities than a more traditional FLB.
I would not start with a large, more expensive, harder to find parts for heli to try it right off the bat. There is a good chance you will mess up settings or just not have things configured in the most optimal way on your first go around. The instructions are pretty good but if you are new not everything will be super clear. I suggest you get a smaller cheaper heli with space and parts available to figure out how you want it setup then you can buy the same FC and other sensors again for a larger heli. The Trex-470 has a fair bit of real-estate and is pretty cheap with easy to find parts, seems like a good try ardupilot platform. The only other thought here is you already have the 800 so that might make it easier to just try it out on that.
You should definitely try it out on something though just for the fun experience.
You are going to be spending a lot of time in the above doc site so you might as well get started now getting used to finding the answers you need. That link will provide more detail than I can to answer your question about your transmitter.
ArduHeli is way more capable than FBL unit. It can provide ful stability augmentation in all axis and control position. It supports autonomous flight.
I would recommend Radiomaster T16S because it runs EdgeTX and is very flexible. I would recommend internal multimodule as it supports DSM and DSMX, external ExpressLRS modules can be more powerful anyways. Though your radio should work if you can turn two switches into one channel with six evenly spaced positions for the mode switch.
If you want to experiment with AH I would recommend H7 equipped FC with baro, if you want to replace FBL units anything with 2MB flash and a baro will be enough. Matek makes good controllers from what I have heard. Cubes are great but way to expensive for experimental build like that.
In my experience with multirotors and planes AP default tunes are good enough not to cause crashes on the first flight so IMHO if you follow the instruction carefully you have good chances of not crashing your heli on the first flight.
In a case of heli I am not sure if you should softmount or hardmount the FC.
I’m giving thought to getting my feet wet with my old 450 Pro first before going larger.
This model currently has a flybarred main rotor head, three analog servos on the swashplate (Hitec HS-65MG), digital servo on the tail (S9257), HobbyWing 60A ESC with an adjustable BEC for 5-8V, and Spektrum AR6110E DSM2 receiver.
Is there a particular FC (preferably inexpensive but reliable) you’d recommend for this sized helicopter that may be compatible with the components I already have?
I’m looking at a Speedybee F405 WING APP right now on Amazon for around $55, but am unsure if it will even support ArduCopter, whether the hardware/firmware will support a flybarred head and analog servos, or how exactly I would wire in my existing ESC in to power the FC or servos.
I will assume that I would need a different receiver, and I see that the above mentioned FC has no port for a DSM2/DSMX satellite (like I’ve seen on more expensive choices). If I understand what I’ve read so far, I believe a Spektrum SRXL2 receiver would be connected to one of the UART ports on this FC per the following instructions on the ArduCopter wiki, correct?
“SRXL2 receivers must be connected to a UART. SRXL2 receivers support a wide range of voltages, including the 5v available on a UART so connect GND to GND, VCC to VCC and the signal wire to the TX pin of the UART.”
Hi @nspector and welcome!
Regarding the size of helicopter: it really depends on your experience flying helicopters manually or with FBL style controllers.
Also, depending on the final use of your setup (FPV if I understood correctly) it might not be that easy to fit all the gears on smaller frames and get a reasonable flight endurance.
I’m well aware Align changes the design/details of parts like pants on all their heli lines, sometimes making them unusable due to lack of spare parts and no interchangeability with more recent models.
Using the 450 is a good choice for gaining experience with the AP environment. I would only suggest to replace all analog servos with digital ones.
It is a big step forward, with a lot more capabilities in terms of flight safety (failsafe/return to home functions), OSD for real time displaying of critical data in your goggles, autonomous flight (if you like it) and of course traditional FBL stabilization, allowing some acro too.
Leave that on the shelf. For a 450 I would recommend this one, provides all that you need and I have been using it for several hours on my Protos380 FPV heli without any issue (https://youtu.be/0GqneGw-bbI).
I transitioned from BeastX PRO to Arducopter with two TRex 500s and one TRex 550. I’ve been learning to fly helis for many years but was getting nowhere beyond tail-in low level flying. I thought the BeastX PRO would give me more confidence because of its ‘recovery’ features, but no.
Arducopter has given me confidence to fly at height in all orientations and at reasonable speed. If I get into trouble I hit the PosHold switch until I figure out what to do next, and in extreme cases I can hit the RTL switch and let it land itself. Most of my flying now is in stabilised mode with AltHold.
My radio gear is all FrSky, and the FC in my first 500 is mRo Pixracer R15, which came with Aruducopter already installed. For my other two helis I used Matek H743WING boards because they’re much cheaper, and available from UK vendors. They’re usually loaded with Betaflight or something like that, so Ardupilot has to be installed on them which can be a bit of a hassle.
I’m not the best pilot…can hover in all orientations upright, can hover nose-in inverted, do flips, and circles, but would really be nice to have more stabilized flight and help for emergencies.
REALLY wanting to fly FPV manually and with position hold.
Can you guys show me your setups or describe to me how I would connect my ESCs/BECs to the controllers you’ve recommended?
Would the servo connector for the BEC be unpinned and the wires soldered onto the boards, or plugged into a connector I’d make, or can it simply be plugged into one of the PWM ports on the board and power the FC?
Another question is, if I have HV servos how are they powered if the FC output is only 5V or 6V on their specs?
The answers to your question depend on exactly which FC board you choose. Generally speaking all servos go direct to output pins on the board (though I did look at a Matek H743MINI which would have required only the servo signal wires connected to the board with separate BEC supply direct to the servos). Some boards, such as the mRo R15, only have 6 PWM outputs (minium required for basic heli operation) while others may have more which can be used for accessories such as camera control. Power to the board may be full LiPo power (up to 8S in the case of my Matek boards), or power from the ESC’s BEC or a stand-alone BEC. My Matek board has an 8A output for servos that can be set to 5v, 6v or 7.2v.
I’m only speaking of boards that I’m familiar with, so you need to research specs before you pick one for your application. Ardupilot have a section in their wiki about choosing a board with, most importantly, a list of boards which are compatible.
The Matek405 comes with internal BEC, so you just have to solder battery +/- cables to the pads. If the ESC has a BEC, just connect signal and ground to S1 and GND pads of the board.
I’m running them on 6V, they are a little slower but no problems.
I decided to build a new smaller model to get started with ArduCopter and ordered an Align 450L kit today.
I’ll probably install the KST DS315MG cyclic servos you recommended Ferrosan.
Would you recommend a tail servo for me?
I’ve been looking a lot at the Matek H743-WING FC. Would this be a good choice in your opinions?
Would a DSMX/DSM2 remote receiver, such as the SPM9745 be the best choice to use with my existing radio (JR/Spektrum)?
If I’m reading the wiring diagram correctly, the above remote receiver would be connected to RX6, 4V5, and G. Is that right? Or would the gray data (pin 3) of the remote receiver go to RX6 only and the power and ground (pins 1 and 2) go to the 3V pad and it’s ground instead?
There’s a note that states that “DSM can work with any spare UART_RX”.
Will the FC accept a second remote receiver for redundancy?
If I also go ahead and purchase a GPS/compass is Matek’s M10Q-5883 a good choice, or is something else better?
I’m not familiar with Spektrum equipment, but RX6 is the normal input for any combined signal such as SBUS or CPPM, with G and 4v5 supplying power to the receiver.
I would normally be happy to recommend the Matek H743WING except that it’s rather large and heavy compared with the mRo R15 and some others. When I first installed mine on the side frame using a well known brand of gyro tape, it fell off after a couple of flights – luckily it was when I was pre-flighting the heli. So I then reinstalled it horizontally between the frames on top of the tail boom gearbox for both my helis. My mRo R15 has been mounted on the side frame with the same tape for about a year now without any sign of it coming off. With the 450L horizontal mounting of the Matek may not be possible due to frame width.
@nspector i would definitely recommend a controller with an H7 processor. I’ve mounted plenty of controllers on the side of heli frame. I use a 2 mm thick foam or rubber tape that has adhesive on both sides. It helps not having to fit it between the frames. Where ever you put it be sure that the mounting location is stiff. I wouldn’t recommend mounting it on a plastic tray
That’s what I meant when I said ‘gyro tape’. The one that fell off my heli was Kyosho 3mm, but it could well have been poor adhesion because the frame was inadequately cleaned. Anyway, the experience led me to top-mounting my two Matek H743WING boards.
I have no experience of the WLITE, but H743MINI would be okay. Servo connections to it are complicated slightly by the fact that its internal 5v BEC is rated for 1.5A which I consider to be not enough for 4 digital heli servos, and the fact that 5v and Gnd pads are not adjacent to the S1 to S10 pads. Thus I would recommend that servo power be provided directly by a suitably rated BEC, and only the servos’ signal wires connected to the S pads on the board.
Thanks again guys for all of your help…really appreciate it!
As far as hardware is concerned…I think I’m slowly catching on.
Is it a bad idea to hard mount the FC vs. doubled-sided foam tape? I like clean/tidy wiring and installs, so I’ll probably mount it onto the gyro mount inside the helicopter if there’s room. I could do the best of both worlds and screw it into the mount with rubber washers in between, unless that may still transmit too much vibration.
It looks like the H743-WLITE will provide 5-7.2V at 8A (10A peak) to the servos, so I think that’ll work.
I’m still trying to figure out is if I should use a full SRXL2 or DSM2/DSMX remote receiver, if either will even work, and where to connect them.
I’m also wondering how many channels I’ll really need.
If I read the wiki correctly, I’ll need at least 8 for ArduCopter.
I have a 9-channel radio (X9503), and if I want to use head tracking for FPV flying later I hope I’ll have enough channels to support it.
I believe Spektrum remotes will support 11 channels, but if I need to get a SRXL2, I’m not sure if I’d need the 10-channel AR10100T, or if that would be overkill.
The only downside to the R15 is last time I tried to buy them there was no stock and no hint of re-stocking date. And just looking at the MRO website, they don’t even list them. Too bad really.
Yes, I clicked on the ‘Notify me’ box for the R15 about a year ago, and among other things (price) lack of delivery info steered me towards Matek boards. There is still the Pixracer Pro though, with 8 PWM channels instead of 6, but at over twice the price of the R15
It all depends on how vibration-free your heli is. I tried the supplied grommets with nylon bolts for my R15, but then still had to use double-sided foam for the housing that was holding the bolts.
